looking at the top stars of Guadalajara, from 1950 to 1986

Alfonso Dantes

Alfonso Dantes is always treated as one of Guadalajara’s great legends of lucha libre, and it’s not hard to see why when looking at the times he’s wrestled in the building. He’s got the most years with the most main events, and he’s got the most matches over all, thru the period I checked.

I put together a list of the three most frequent main eventers each year. I’ve split it up by building, for the few years where there was competition. It’ll kinda give you an idea of how the top stars changed over time.

Arena Coliseo Guadalajara/
Parque Oro
(where top>10)
Arena Canada Dry/
Plaza de Toros
(where top >10)
1950 Pablo Romero (27)
Saul Montes (17)
El Asesino (17)
1951 Joe El Hermoso (28)
Bobby Segura (27)
El Asesino (26)
1952 Bobby Segura (19)
Cavernario Galindo (16)
Blue Demon (14)
1953 Medico Asesino (29)
El Bulldog (28)
Polo Torres (27)
1954 Cavernario Galindo (14)
Blue Demon (10)
Black Shadow (9)
Medico Asesino (35)
El Bulldog (31)
El Enfermero (24)
1955 Espectro I (34)
Medico Asesino (33)
Abel Krim (29)
1956 Cavernario Galindo (27)
Medico Asesino (17)
Jorge Allende (16)
1957 Rolando Vera (36)
Carlos Moreno (22)
Espectro I (18)
1958 Monje Loco (47)
Carlos Moreno (38)
Abel Krim (26)
1959 Felipe Ham Lee (8)
Kiko Van Dick (8)
Dorrel Dixon (8)
Rolando Vera (43)
Black Shadow (39)
El Santo (38)
1960 Oso Negro (60s) (19)
René Guajardo (16)
Kiko Van Dick (16)
El Monje Loco (32)
Red Terror (28)
Pantera Negra (25)
1961 Red Terror (19)
Gori Guerrero (18)
Cavernario Galindo (17)
1962 Espanto I (30)
Pantera Blanca (60s) (29)
Rito Romero (25)
1963 Red Terror (22)
El Santo (21)
Benny Gallant (21)
1964 Pantera Blanca (60s) (38)
Red Terror (18)
El Santo (18)
1965 Karloff Lagarde (27)
René Guajardo (24)
Pantera Blanca (60s) (22)
1966 Ray Mendoza (21)
Alberto Muñoz (20)
Espanto II (20)
1967 Alfonso Dantes (23)
Pantera Blanca (60s) (21)
Ray Mendoza (21)
1968 Gemelo Diablo II (29)
Gemelo Diablo I (28)
Alfonso Dantes (19)
1969 Rayo de Jalisco Sr. (22)
El Solitario (22)
Septiembre Negro (22)
1970 El Solitario (25)
Mr. Koma (24)
Alberto Muñoz (21)
1971 Ciclon Veloz Jr. (28)
El Solitario (24)
Enrique Vera (22)
1972 El Solitario (25)
Alberto Muñoz (22)
René Guajardo (19)
1973 Alfonso Dantes (27)
El Solitario (22)
Perro Aguayo Sr. (19)
1974 Alfonso Dantes (26)
Ángel Blanco (22)
Jose Escobedo (17)
1975 Dr. Wagner (34)
Alberto Muñoz (30)
Alfonso Dantes (28)
El Solitario (21)
Renato Torres (16)
Ángel Blanco (14)
1976 Perro Aguayo Sr. (35)
Ringo Mendoza (35)
Alfonso Dantes (33)
1977 Perro Aguayo Sr. (37)
Ringo Mendoza (32)
El Halcón (30)
1978 El Faraón (32)
Ringo Mendoza (31)
Alfonso Dantes (29)
1979 Alfonso Dantes (41)
Satoru Sayama (35)
Ringo Mendoza (33)
1980 Alfonso Dantes (37)
Cachorro Mendoza (36)
El Faraón (35)
1981 Ringo Mendoza (36)
Alfonso Dantes (35)
El Halcón (30)
1982 El Faraón (29)
Lizmark (27)
El Halcón (26)
1983 Ringo Mendoza (27)
Américo Rocca (25)
La Fiera (20)
1984 Ringo Mendoza (39)
Rayo de Jalisco Jr. (22)
Cachorro Mendoza (19)
1985 Rayo de Jalisco Jr. (20)
Máscara Año 2000 (19)
Pirata Morgan (18)
Gran Cochisse (16)
Atlantis (14)
El Dandy (10)

Alfonso Dantes has the most main events in five years. No one else has more than 3 (Ringo Mendoza & Solitario if you count his busiest self promoted year.) He’s one of three biggest main eventers from 1967 to 1981, and is still around in a lesser role thru the end of the period and likely beyond.

The names all do change from year to year; it’s rare for someone to be in the most main events two straight years, and the top 3 never stays stable. I think this is because Guadalajara is used as a place to for up and coming talent, maybe a little bit before they were used in the same roles in Mexico City. Once they got hot, they were spending their Sundays (and maybe some Tuesdays) working arenas around Mexico City.

The 10 match list has a lot of familiar names.

495 Alfonso Dantes
375 Ringo Mendoza
274 Rayo de Jalisco Sr.
265 El Santo
240 René Guajardo
234 El Faraón
231 Ray Mendoza
229 el Halcón/Danny Ortiz
225 Rolando Vera
219 Blue Demon

Again, Dantes has 100 more matches than the next nearest person, and 200 more than anyone besides Ringo. Maybe this would look a lot different if we had the full lineups for these shows – maybe Dantes just made the top matches quicker – but Dantes is a pretty dominant presence. I’ve got a stronger idea of how important el Halcon and El Faraon were for a time, and I think we’d see guys like Atlantis, Rayo de Jalisco Jr. and the Dinamitas on this lift if I had lineups into the 90s.

There’s plenty of big names not included. Angel Blanco, el Solitario and Perro Aguayo are all among the top 20. The relationship between EMLL and UWA was friendly enough that UWA wrestlers did work in Arena Coliseo Guadalajara from time to time, but only infrequently. Solitario’s attempt to run his own promotion – basically only weeks when the bullring wasn’t running bullfights – didn’t seem to be on any regularly scheduled. It’s possible they were running smaller local venue which didn’t show up in the paper, but UWA also seemed to put together a regular loop of towns that were generally closer to Mexico City, and so may have not focused much on Guadalajara.

Another thing that stuck out to me about the top guys in Guadalajara is the era of Santo, Demon and Rayo de Jalisco is a lot shorter than I thought. Santo’s retirement isn’t until 1983, and Demon and Rayo are still around until the start of the 90s, but they’re not wrestling here all that often. Santo’s working heavily for the opposition group when Arena Coliseo Guadalajara opens and is pretty much down as a big star there in the mid 60s. Demon’s barely around long before that. I’d guessed Rayo was a top star for a long period of time, but he’s not really after 1970. It’s the Mendozas, Sangre Chicana, early Perro Aguayo and Alfonso Dantes carrying things thru the 70s. The Perro Aguayo/Ringo Mendoza feud itself seems to carry long stretches of time the way nothing else does.

One last thing: check out Satoru Sayama cracking the list in 1979. Sayama’s booked like a top guys of a promotion, in a promotion that rarely has build around foreigners. (Benny Galant in the 1963 is the previous one.) Sayama was so good that EMLL got over it’s usual preoccupations to actually use him as a shooting star.

CMLL 12/25 show to be on iPPV, Dorada title match, CMLL lineups

CMLL 12/25 Infierno en el Ring show will be another iPPV. The Cleeng site lists it as for $10. This is the 12 person cage match show starting at 5pm. We don’t know what else will be on the show, and it’s possible CMLL doesn’t announce the full lineup until the week before show. This is probably live only; the shows haven’t been available on VOD.

The 01/01 Thunder versus Ultimo Guerrero mask vs hair match would’ve been my guess for an iPPV show of the two shows. Maybe it still will be, CMLL might not be able to advertise two shows at once.

(As always: I’m not posting the iPPV at least until it’s scheduled to air on TV, and maybe even later than that.)

Just after I posted yesterday, El Rey officially announced the Lucha Underground Season 2 premiere date was 01/27. That’s one week later than I thought yesterday, but it fits the pattern of that date moving around. El Rey’s press release on the season two start date also mentioned they’d air five hours of Lucha Underground every Wednesday. That’s what they were doing before the hiatus, and makes me think El Rey knew Lucha Underground was coming back in january but wasn’t exactly sure which week, so they just started blocking all the Wednesdays off to be safe. The network will also run a marathon of all season 1 episodes on the weekend before the premiere, running Saturday 01/23 10AM ET to Monday 01/24 2AM. That’s something I was begging for them to do at the end of this season and is good to see them doing next week.

A poster on reddit noticed El Rey’s website “Watch Now” page now has VOD options for the other El Rey shows and a “coming soon” under Lucha Underground. The El Rey website is spare and static; it’s a little newsworthy they updated anything. I don’t think it actually means they’re any closer than they’ve been any time over the last 15 months. If something was happening or close to happening, it would’ve been in that same Season 2 press release. Maybe it’ll just be announced at some unexpected point of time like the season 2 renewal, but it doesn’t feel like we’re that much closer.

AAA has an interview with Fenix talking about his feud with Mesias. These bits don’t do much for me, but it’s now reassuring to be reminded AAA exists when we’re back to no next TV taping.

NJPW announced Mascara Dorada will defend the CMLL Welterweight Championship against BUSHI on 12/19. That’s a 3:30 AM Saturday show in the Central Time Zone, about four and half hours after the CMLL show wraps up that night.

LuchaWorld has KrisZ’s news update.

Apolo Valdes says AAA had a bad year but is not in crisis.


CMLL (MON) 12/14/2015 Arena Puebla
1) Arkalis, Magia Blanca, Rey Samuray vs Apocalipsis, Cholo, Fuerza Chicana
2) Espíritu Maligno & Lestat vs Disturbio & Policeman
3) La Vaquerita, Lluvia, Marcela vs Amapola, Dalys, Reyna Isis
4) Fuego, Rey Cometa, Stigma vs Canelo Casas, Okumura, Skándalo
5) La Máscara, Máximo Sexy, Rush vs Felino, Mr. Niebla, Negro Casas
6) Atlantis vs Último Guerrero

Slightly better card? Maybe I’m just hyped for tecnico Espiritu Maligno?

The fourth match is the third straight week for that trios match for some reason. It doesn’t feel like they’re setting up a match anywhere in there. I’d be willing to believe it was listed there by mistake, because five trios matches and a three fall singles match is unusual for Puebla.

Magia Blanca works the opener for the third time in a row. This would be Cholo’s first TV appearance since July; the changes in the streaming days and C3 going away has caused him to vanish, but he’s also only working once every two weeks right now.

CMLL (TUE) 12/15/2015 Arena México
1) Bengala & Leono vs Artillero & Cholo
2) Flyer, Robin, Starman vs Akuma, Arkángel de la Muerte, Canelo Casas
3) Hombre Bala Jr., Stigma, Súper Halcón Jr. vs Puma, Skándalo, Tiger
4) Blue Panther Jr. vs Okumura [lightning]
5) Blue Panther, Delta, Guerrero Maya Jr. vs Misterioso Jr., Pierroth, Sagrado
6) Mistico, Stuka Jr., Titán vs Dragón Rojo Jr., Rey Bucanero, Vangellys

Main event continues the road to Titan/Dragon Rojo. May be important that Titan is heading to Japan and Dragon Rojo is not.

CMLL (TUE) 12/15/2015 Arena Coliseo Guadalajara
1) León Blanco & Omar Brunetti vs Relampago & Rey Trueno
2) Magnus, Sensei, Soberano Jr. vs Camorra, Inquisidor, Maléfico
3) Marcela, Princesa Sugehit, Silueta vs Amapola, La Seductora, Zeuxis
4) La Máscara, Máximo Sexy, Valiente vs Boby Z, Felino, Hechicero
5) Marco Corleone, Super Porky, Volador Jr. vs Euforia, Niebla Roja, Último Guerrero

I can’t think of anything to write about this show. There’s a lot of the same kind of tecnicos in the top two matches.

Lucha Memes (FRI) 12/25/2015 Arena Naucalpan
1) Negro Navarro vs Virus
2) Black Terry & El Dandy vs Trauma I & Trauma II
3) Keira vs Marcela © [CMLL WOMEN]
Marcela’s 3rd defense.
4) Negro Casas vs Dr. Cerebro
5) Arez, Belial, Impulso vs Decnnis, Toscano, Zumbido
6) Freelance, Mike Segura, Septimo Rayo, Supermega vs Alas de Acero, Aramis, Demasiado, Iron Kid
7) Atlantis vs Caifan

Full card for this show, and it’s definitely full. There’s maybe more here than Lucha Memes needs – if you’re Casas/Cerbero and Atlantis/Caifan will both be good, but feel like an overlap – but maybe Christmas is going to be busy enough that you do all you can just to make sure people show up.

We do know CMLL is running at 5pm on this day, which means this show (starting a half hour later) is kind of running in competition – and Casas, Virus, and Atlantis are presumably not part of Infierno en el Ring show. I’d pay $10 for this on iPPV too.

Edit: Nah, Atlantis, Casas and Marcela are working Infierno and then coming to Naucalpan.

UWE (FRI) 12/25/2015 Arena Lopez Mateos
1) Palacio Maya & Prehispanic vs Alas De Oro & Ninja Olimpus
2) Freelance & Spider Boy vs Coco Negro Jr. & Ironía
3) Ángel Del Amor, Mike Segura, Yakuza vs Epitafio, Leviatham, Samael
4) ?, Flamita, Súper Nova vs Dr. Cerebro, Sádico, Toscano
5) LA Park, Trauma I, Trauma II vs Aeroboy, Pagano, Violento Jack

Another Christmas show, as they load up. Toscano and Dr. Cerbero should be able to make both shows; this is an 8 pm start time, Lucah Memes is 5:30.

the Occidente championships have always been useless and need to go away

why do you exist

I shouldn’t even have a post here. The title seems good enough, but I might as well walk thru the case.

The Occidente championships – the championships of Arena Coliseo Guadalajara, basically – haven’t been used in much of a meaningful way for years. They seem like they may come in the 1940s, following the naming scheme of the Norte championships. The Occidente championships are still around. I can name a stunningly high amount of them (test at the bottom), but they’re rarely defended and frequently held by people who don’t actually wrestle in Arena Coliseo Guadalajara much, or by young luchadors hoping to soon stop wrestling in Arena Coliseo Guadalajara. There seems to be no purpose to them outside of making everyone feel better about the things they don’t have by giving them a shiny belt, and they’re never used as a draw or show any capability of being a draw. It’s not a lot different than many lucha libre championships, but the high rate of Occidente championships just being given up because the champion can’t be bothered/allowed to lose them in the ring makes them stick out in a negative way.

Perhaps, I thought, these were formally useful championships in times past and the best uses of them just hadn’t carried over to more modern times?


These Occidente championships were never used in the main event or as drawing card; the national and world titles would, but also super libre matches. These were distinctly treated as third rate championships, and the titles either went vacant or mysterious changed hands without a title change many times. By title:

  • Welterweight: four different tournaments for vacant titles (two ending where the winner never apparently defends the title), and one other unexplained title change
  • Middleweight: five tournaments for vacant titles (three without clear winner), five other unexplained title changes
  • Light Heavyweight: two tournaments for a vacant title (one with unknown winner), six other unexplained changes
  • Heavyweight: one tournament (because champion wins better title)
  • Tag Team two vacant title tournamnets, five times an unexplained title history.

The tag title belts are actually the best handled ones for quite a while. There’s plenty of defenses, the title changes are easy to follow. It falls apart later on. The trios title doesn’t come into being until the very end of the period. There’s a women’s championship which appears to exist for two shows seven years apart. Lightweight and featherweight (!) champions are mentioned earlier on, but completely disappear. And they’re not the only titles who disappear for a time. The light heavyweight title goes with disappears for two years. The tag team and middleweight championships are invisible for three years. The welterweight championship goes six years without a mention, and the heavyweight championship just vanishes after 1959 never to return. Life continues on, maybe better than ever in some cases, without these championships.

To be fair, I’m working off incomplete records. Maybe some of those missing title changes (and defenses) took place in the those early matches that aren’t recorded. Maybe the heavyweight championship or other titles changed hands at a smaller show in Guadalajara, or changed hands elsewhere in the region. I could imagine a loop of places like Lagos de Moreno, Tula, Tonala, Ciudad Guzman or wherever else got regular shows, and the Occidente championships have a use on those since they’re too small to get bigger matches.

Even if those things were true, which I’m not sure if they were, they’re no longer that way. The belts are rarely defended, in the top or bottom of cards. There is no loop of other towns, and they barely appear on shows outside of Arena Coliseo Gudalajara. No one seems to see Occidente title matches as a important item and it wouldn’t make a lot of sense to bring in an Occident title match to draw a crowd; they’re just some place else’s local wrestlers, not stars because they’re defending a prestigious belt.

There are solutions to this

  • get rid off all the belts! Or, if you can’t do that, get rid of most of them. Pick an in between weight belt and just treat it like an open weight belt (like they do with all the titles right now), and then you’re less likely to forgot about them if you don’t have as many of them, and you don’t really need six belts when you’re running 2 shows a week.
  • if you can’t just get rid of them, farm them out to other promotions – maybe htey’ll make more use of them they you can.
  • obviously, none of the CMLL Mexico City roster members should hold one of these belts. It should be completely beneath them. They’re minor league championships and CMLL DF guys should come off as above that.
  • if the belts aren’t going to be defended more than once year, than why not just run more tournaments instead? Single week tournaments are not great shakes, but most of the title matches happen with no plan for the future after the big victory at the end. Save yourself the embarrassment of having no plan by having a tournament that doesn’t need a follow up (and then there you can have the local guy beat the Mexico City guy without having to figure out how you’re going to get out of it next week.)
  • make a list of who’s champion somewhere? Maybe so you’ll remember, maybe so the fans might know? You shouldn’t really be needing to rely on me for this info.

But if you are relying on me, the current champions are

Welterweight: Sadico (maybe), last defended July 19, 2015 at Arena Coliseo Guadalajara on a show where they didn’t post results.

Middleweight: Virgo, last defended May 15, 2015

Light Heavyweight: Puma, last defended June 23, 2015

Heavyweight: Diamante Azul, last defended May 6, 2014

Tag Team: Gallo & Esfinge, last defended July 18, 2015

Trios: Cuatrero, Forastero and Sanson, last defended November 11, 2015

The last one is pretty recent, but they’re also the guys who say they’re headed to the Mexico City roster pretty soon (and haven’t been around these shows much since the title change anyway.) Everything else hasn’t been defended in five months. Maybe they’ve beat me to it and got rid of the titles already.

lineups and notes from thirty five years of Guadalajara lineups

gdl header

I’ve been looking thru online archives are of Guadalajara’s El Informador for the last six months, taking screen shots of the advertisements for local lucha libre shows and transcribing them for my luchadb. The stretch I’ve recorded covers about 35 years of shows. That includes many events, most of them, which don’t appear to be listed in most event databases. I’ve been adding them in year stretches as I’ve gone along, and you can find all the complete run of lineups here. (Feel free to use it however, though credit back is always appreciated.)

I’ve talked about these before when I was doing posts on singles year, but in case you’re new or haven’t read the: Those lineups are great deal of information, but they’re also far from complete. I’ve going thru the paper from 1950 to 1986. There appears to be lucha libre in Guadalajara in the mid 30s, and “lucha amaetur” (which could’ve been worked) a few years prior. I expect I’ll go add the missing years at some point, but 1950 worked out as a break point. The paper starts printing the lineups in August 1986, not regularly listing them again until a stretch in 2009 (which seemed to be part of an advertising deal between Arena Coliseo Guadalajara at the paper.) If you’ve got a way of me getting 1986 to 2009 lineups, let me know.

Almost all the lineups are simply lineups – the paper didn’t cover the results – and almost all of them are the final few matches on the cards. It’s the announced lineup, so changes aren’t accounted for, and the shows with tournaments or seeding battle royales don’t list the matches. Shows scheduled on irregular days – like Solitario’s promotion – might be missed, as all are smaller arenas who wouldn’t be advertising in a paper. (Arena Jalisco and Arena Obeletos get their lineups in the paper on their openings, then never again.) There also days where a lineup wouldn’t appear for whatever reason, or rarely a day where the paper for the day wasn’t archived. This isn’t bulletproof data, but it’s a good starting point for a time span and a busy region that’s not well covered publically.

The most surprising knowledge I learned from all of this is EMLL came to Guadalajara as the invaders. It might have not started that way. Cursory looks at the 1930s show the Lutteroth family as introducing lucha libre to the arena, but it’s other promoters running events by the 1950s. The battle between the promotions lasted from Arena Coliseo Guadalajara’s opening (with a boxing show) from 1959 thru a few years into 1961. The existing promoters had the bigger names, with Santo mostly working for them and Rayo de Jalisco seemingly starting on those shows, but EMLL was able to take over the area. It’s one of three notable moments of competition in this period: a group was running in Parque Oro in 1956 and a Solitario led promotion in the mid 1970s which appeared very irregularly.

The Solitario group was a UWA backed one but the UWA name was rarely used on the advertisements. It only really comes up when a title was defended, and that’s more than the name came up for the opposition. There’s never a promotional name given for Arena Coliseo Guadalajara promotion. It’s obvious it’s EMLL and there’s no attempt to hide it, but the name just isn’t important enough to be used. Neither is the NWA name. Title matches there are listed simply as “Campeonato Mundial” or “Nacional”, outside a couple UWA title matches.

Most of the shows are just random matches, much like today. There’s some title matches and puesta matches each year, more so when there’s competition and more as the years have gone on. (There’s weirdly no title matches in the first fall 50s, even though people are billed as champions.) Luchadoras wrestle for a few weeks once or twice each year. There seems to be one or two foreigners every year for a while, until they just disappear from appearing. Famed California tag team Goliath and Black Gordman are on shows thru the 60s, but never as a team until the 70s.

I’ve have a couple most posts on this data set later this week.

CMLL 12 masked man cage match on 12/25, Ultimo Guerrero contra Thunder on 01/01

photo by CMLL

CMLL’s press conference just wrapped up.

The Ultimo Guerrero/Thunder feud, which has taken up most of 2015, will finally reach a climax on the first day of 2016. Ultimo Guerrero signed a contract to put his hair on the line against Thunder’s mask for the Sin Piedad show. Thunder will sign the contract later today on CMLL Informa. It seemed possible CMLL might stretch this feud out even longer for Dos Leyendas, but now they’ll be free to move on to anything else. Ultimo Guerrero is the heavy favorite to win match, and they’ll employ every trick to attempt to make it good.

The other major event coming up, Infierno en el Ring, will have a cage match as expected. It’ll be twelve men in the cage, with the loser losing his mask. The Panther, Blue Panther Jr., Esfinge, Fuego, Triton, Pegasso, Tiger, Puma, Cancerbero, Raziel, Sangre Azteca, and Super Comando will participate. Comando & T. Panther have had the longest running feud of the bunch and are the most likely final two, but there’s been plenty of other challenge thrown out. Guys like Pegasso, Cancerbero and Raziel are reasonable possibilities given where they are in their point of this career.

Tickets go on sale for both shows. Kids tickets will be 10 pesos (though not in the first group of rows.) These should be big turnouts for both shows.

CMLL also announced the Copa Junior would return in January on Tuesday shows. This year’s format will be two 8 man ciberneticos, with the winners facing off on 01/19. Block A will take place on 01/05 with Tiger, Canelo Casas, Sanson (debuting), Espanto Jr., The Panther, Hombre Bala Jr., Soberano Jr., and Esfinge. Block B will take place on 01/12 with Puma, Hijo del Signo, Skandalo, Cuatrero (debuting), Blue Panther Jr., Super Halcon Jr., Oro Jr. and Magnus.

Tiger and Puma are the favorites in both blocks, but it’s unlikely we’ll see them face off. The A group is more up in the air, with The Panther, Hombre Bala and Soberano Jr. all being good alternative choices.

The press conference started off with talk about the NJPW/CMLL relationship. CMLL claimed all the FantasicaMania shows were sold out (not quite accurate). Mascara Dorada will return to CMLL in February. CMLL also said more NJPW trainees would be coming, and it would be more than 1. NJPW’s Sho Tanaka and Yohei Komatsu are believed to be leaving Japan for training early next year, and it was assumed/rumored they’d be going to separate places. Perhaps it’s not true, or perhaps one of the other young wrestlers are coming with them.

Alberto blames disorganized AAA, CMLL mask challenges, Lucha Underground season 2 premiere date?

photo by Alexis Salazar/CMLL

CMLL (SUN) 12/06/2015 Arena Coliseo Guadalajara [Fuego en el Ring]
1) Micro & Rey Halcón b Demonio Rojo & Destructor
2) Johnny Dinamo & Linterna b Mr. Apolo & Mr. Brisa
3) Vaquero Jr. DQ Exterminador [super libre]
Exterminador faked a foul, but the fans convinced the referee that it was a fake and he gave Vaquero the DQ win.
4) Gallo, Magnum, Omar Brunetti b Ráfaga, Relampago, Sádico
5) Gran Guerrero, Mosco X Fly, Último Guerrero b Ángel de Oro, Esfinge, Tritón
Rudos took 2/3, with X-Fly winning it for the rudos.

CMLL (TUE) 12/08/2015 Arena México [CMLL]
1) Fantasy & Último Dragoncito b Pequeño Nitro & Pequeño Olímpico
2) Arkángel de la Muerte, Hijo del Signo, Nitro b Magnus, Robin, Sensei
Rudos took 2/3. Nitro & Arkangel replaced Disturbio & Skandalo on Friday. Nitro still using a piledriver as a finish.
3) Puma, Sangre Azteca, Tiger DQ Fuego, Pegasso, Tritón
Tecnicos were winning the first fall, but Tiger hit the referee and somehow convinced the ref that Pegasso did it. Sangre Azteca pulled off the mask of one of the tecnicos and pinned him for the straight fall wins. Everyone pulled everyone else’s mask after the match and ended up with someone else’s mask on.
4) Guerrero Maya Jr. DQ Boby Z [lightning]
6:36. Bobby Z pulled Maya’s mask for the DQ.
5) Niebla Roja, Rey Bucanero, Vangellys b Delta, Rey Cometa, Valiente
Rudos took 2/3.
6) Atlantis, Titán, Volador Jr. b Dragón Rojo Jr., Hechicero, Pólvora
Titan beat Dragon Rojo and challenged for a title match.

Titan and Dragon Rojo is exciting. Looks like those six guys in the mask match for sure. Add Raziel, Cancerbero, Esfinge and one more tecnico to get to ten.

No full results from Guadalajara. Mephisto, Ephesto and Luciferno kept the trios titles. I’ll have a separate post on this afternoon’s press conference later this afternoon. Maybe they’ll have the CMLL lineups too; nothing for the Monday and Tuesday shows yet.

Alberto says he’s disappointed he could not say goodbye to his Mexican fans and blamed it completely on AAA’s internal disorganization. Cancha has the interview, but their paywall causes that link to stop working; SuperLuchas has the key quotes. Alberto’s claim is WWE authorized him to fulfill his previously scheduled matches and he was planning on working both Guerra de Titanes and a show in Culiacan. Alberto says AAA later changed the dates of those shows to days where he had now had WWE commitments and could no longer work those shows. Alberto says AAA knew or at least should’ve known moving those dates would’ve made him unavailable to work those shows and it’s AAA’s fault he didn’t defend (and presumably) lose the AAA championship in the ring.

The pieces are not all fitting together on this story. AAA hasn’t run a show in Culiacan since July. Maybe it got canceled without Alberto, or maybe we just never saw the advertisements (definitely possible for a lot of AAA shows, much less likely for an Alberto show.) There’s no mention of Alberto not working the Monterrey show, which never moved and never had a conflict with WWE. It seems unlikely WWE would let Alberto go some place else and defend a title, but they did let Alberto do sort of that with WWC.

This feels like some level of spin on Alberto’s part. He left WWE and alleged racism – not just about the incident that led him to being fired, but the general culture – and then ended up walking out on the Mexican company and going back as a anti-immigrant heel (and a pretty unover one.) For image reasons, he needed to pass the blame somewhere else. The “I could never say goodbye to my Mexican fans!” bit rings hollow when he has a functioning Twitter account where he has time to post about Real Madrid and whatever else. At the same time, it’s seemed for a while that the AAA office is disorganized and Alberto’s story fits that narrative. If you’re really feeling generous to Alberto’s story, maybe the reason AAA has been saying only nice things about Alberto is they’ve been trying to keeping him happy and avoid him doing this sort of interview. This would seem to burn the bridge between AAA & Alberto, but I’m guessing Alberto doesn’t think he’s ever working Mexico full time again and everyone will get along in a couple years if they can make money again.

Lucha Underground’s season two start date is currently January 20th. This Saturday’s episodes are number nine and ten. The ticket info for them list them as airing on March 23rd and March 30th, and you get to January 20th by working backwards. They’ve suggested other dates at other times, so this could still change until they officially announce it. It does fit with the idea that they’d have most/all of this season’s episodes recorded before anything airs.

Edit: It’s the 27th.

WrestingInc says Rey Mysterio will probably be appearing at the Lucha Underground Temple this weekend. They quote one source saying he’s signed or close to signing. It think it’s the first of those two options. Lucha Underground haven’t said anything about this and definitely will prefer it to be a surprise, but it’s out there enough that it seems worth talking about. Mysterio was announced as too injured to wrestle on Friday night in Neza, but still did get in a 619. No idea what shape he’ll be in this week. Mysterio has been connected to Lucha Underground before Lucha Underground existed; announcing Mysterio’s signing with the official return date on Saturday would get a lot of attention. The timing makes sense for a number reasons: without spoiling anything, Saturday’s first taping sets up to be one with surprise debuts and returns for storyline reasons. It’s also about 1/3rd of the way into the season, so best debut people by sometime this weekend if they’re intended to have a major in-ring role in Season 2.

CMLL has a piece hyping the Caristico/Mistico team up, with both guys praising each other. They’re not actually teaming up this week, but some week maybe. The article starts off by noting the current Mistico has gotten “all kinds of reviews”, which is accurate.

On today’s NJPW show, new rudo BUSHI walked off with Mascara Dorada’s mask and Welterweight championship, leading to the logical assumption of a title match sometime soon. Dorada’s not defended the championship all year in NJPW. It’s unlikely that match would be on the Tokyo Dome, but the 01/05 show after the Dome, FantasticaMania, or even the late December tour are possible locations. All of us planning on jumping back on NJPW World only for the Tokyo Dome and/or FantasticaMania might have to subscribe a little bit earlier.

12/25 LuchaMemes updated card:
Lucha Memes added another match to their 12/25 card. Show so far
Negro Navarro vs Virus
Black Terry & El Dandy vs Trauma I & Trauma II
Keira vs Marcela (c) for CMLL Women’s Championship
Negro Casas vs Dr. Cerbero
Arez, Belial, Impulso vs Toscano, Decnnis, Zumbido
Supermega, Freelance, Mike Segura, Septimo Rayo vs Demasiado, Alas de Acero, Aramis, Iron Kid – new

CMLL is hosting a toy drive on 12/19 at Arena Mexico. Negro Casas, Felino, Zacarias, Puma, Triton, Fuego, Blue Panther Jr., and KeMonito will take a photo with anyone who donates a toy.

LuchaWorld has KrisZ’s news update.

KronoSport posts a video interview with Marco Corleone, where he says he has nothing against AAA and enjoyed his first few months there, but it felt like the worst mistake of his life after that.

El Sabor del Ring writes about one year after Arena Coliseo San Luis Potosi closed and the need for a new star to draw people to local shows.

Segunda Caida writes about the King Jaguar & Lestat vs Disturbio & Policeman match from Monday and raves about Rey Mysterio vs Low Ki

Eric Mutter writes about Dragon Lee vs Kamaitachi and Negro Casas.

Video interview with Niebla Roja.

Juan Maldad looks back at Gallo Tapado.

Fuego en el Ring interviews Zeuxis.


CMLL ELITE (SUN) 12/13/2015 Arena México
1) Lluvia & Muñeca De Plata vs Dallys la Caribeña & Reina Isis
2) Fuego & Imposible vs Eterno & Fresero Jr.
3) Golden Magic & Tritón vs Cancerbero & Raziel
4) Super Crazy & The Panther vs Felino & Puma
5) La Máscara & Marco Corleone vs Halloween & Mosco X Fly
6) Carístico & Rush vs Mephisto & Sharlie Rockstar

Rush & Caristico is an odd pairing. This is the first time they’ve ever teamed in Arena Mexico; they’re listed as partners in late 2010 on a spot show in Jalisco just before Mistico left.

Some of the undercard looks really good. Nice to see Imposible getting a spot here, but he’s on the wrong side.

IWRG (SUN) 12/13/2015 Arena Naucalpan
1) Aramis vs Adrenalina
2) Black Dragón & Shadow Boy vs Ángel De La Muerte I & Ángel De La Muerte II
3) Fireman, Omega, Rocket vs Atomic Star, Hijo del Fishman, Hip Hop Man
4) Pantera I vs Imposible [super libre]
one fall match
5) Cerebro Negro, Dr. Cerebro, Mr. 450 vs Apolo Estrada, Eterno, Relámpago
6) Danny Casas, Hijo De Dos Caras, Toscano, Veneno vs Canis Lupus, Máscara Año 2000 Jr., Pirata Morgan, X-Fly

Mr. 450 is back again quick. Imposible is going to have to hurry from Arena Mexico.

The poster lists the Arena Naucalpan Anniversary show on 12/20.

UWE (FRI) 12/25/2015 Arena Lopez Mateos
1) Palacio Maya & Prehispanic vs Alas De Oro & Ninja Olimpus
2) Freelance & Spider Boy vs Coco Negro Jr. & Ironía
3) Ángel Del Amor, Mike Segura, Yakuza vs Epitafio, Leviatham, Samael
4) ?, Flamita, Súper Nova vs Dr. Cerebro, Sádico, Toscano
5) LA Park, Trauma I, Trauma II vs Aeroboy, Pagano, Violento Jack

The Christmas shows are adding up. There were many shows on Independence Day and they all seemed to do well, so maybe this will work again. Flamtia and Sadico were good against each other earlier this year.

AAA on Televisa: 2015-11-14 

Aerostar springboard reverse frog splash?

Recapped: 12/01/2015

What happened: Dr. Wagner Jr. returned, helped Rey win the main event tag match, then turned on him post match to everyone’s confusion. Wagner appears to be taking over Myzteziz’s spot as the rudo loner, but it might be months before we see him again.

Daga and Australian Suicide continue to feud, though Suicide got the trios win this week. Electroshock started on the tecnico side, is still getting attacked by Hijo del Pirata for no apparent reason.

What was good: I liked the opener a lot. You can stop watching at that point.

Where can I watch it: It’s on my channel, and now up on AAA’s channel. (more…)

great match roundup, week of 2015-11-14

A week of matches I’ll largely forget about.

Monday night Puebla recap.

Friday night Arena Mexico recap.


rating matches TV Show taped
good Aerostar, Australian Suicide, Laredo Kid vs Daga, Hijo de Pirata Morgan, Steve Pain AAA on Televisa: 2015-11-14 2015-11-02
good Fuego, Rey Cometa, Stigma vs Boby Z, Disturbio, Virus CMLL Internet Exclusives: 2015-11-16 2015-11-16
good Ángel de Oro vs Hechicero in a lightning match CMLL Internet Exclusives: 2015-11-16 2015-11-16
good Mistico, Valiente, Volador Jr. © vs Cavernario, Mr. Niebla, Negro Casas for the CMLL World Trios Championship CMLL Internet Exclusives: 2015-11-16 2015-11-16
good Blue Panther, Blue Panther Jr., The Panther vs Felino, Puma, Tiger CMLL on ClaroSports.com: 2015-11-20 2015-11-20
good Atlantis, Dragon Lee, Volador Jr. vs Kamaitachi, Mr. Niebla, Negro Casas CMLL on ClaroSports.com: 2015-11-20 2015-11-20
ok Electroshock, Fénix, Psycho Clown vs Taurus, Texano Jr., Zorro AAA on Televisa: 2015-11-14 2015-11-02
ok Meyer & Paris vs Artillero & Súper Comando CMLL Internet Exclusives: 2015-11-16 2015-11-16
ok Black Tiger, Millenium, Oro Jr. vs Policeman, Rey Apocalipsis, Toro Bill Jr. CMLL Internet Exclusives: 2015-11-16 2015-11-16
ok Atlantis, Diamante Azul, Dragón Rojo Jr. vs La Máscara,Marco Corleone, Último Guerrero in a relevos increíbles match CMLL Internet Exclusives: 2015-11-16 2015-11-16
ok Fantasy & Stukita vs Demus 3:16 & Mercurio CMLL on ClaroSports.com: 2015-11-20 2015-11-20
ok Guerrero Maya Jr., Máximo Sexy, Stuka Jr. vs Kráneo, Morphosis, Ripper CMLL on ClaroSports.com: 2015-11-20 2015-11-20
ok La Máscara, Marco Corleone, Rush vs Rey Bucanero, Shocker, Terrible CMLL on ClaroSports.com: 2015-11-20 2015-11-20
below average Dr. Wagner Jr. & Rey Misterio Jr. vs Brian Cage & Hijo del Fantasma AAA on Televisa: 2015-11-14 2015-11-02
below average Hombre Bala Jr., Pegasso, Súper Halcón Jr. vs Arkángel de la Muerte, Sangre Azteca, Súper Comando CMLL on ClaroSports.com: 2015-11-20 2015-11-20

Marco defeats Shocker, CMLL to hold press conference this Wednesday

insightful commentary

CMLL (MON) 12/07/2015 Arena Puebla [thecubsfan]
1) Black Tiger, Flyer, Magia Blanca b Akuma, Ares, Espíritu Maligno LA MEJOR LUCHA LIBRE DEL MUNDO EN VIVO 7 DE DICIEMBRE DEL 2015- 21:00 HRS (posted by VideosOficialesCMLL)
13:45, tecnicos took 2/3. Akuma suffered a left knee injury on the second fall finish and had trouble continuing the match. He returned long enough to take a dive from Magia Blanca.
2) Disturbio & Policeman DQ King Jaguar & Lestat LA MEJOR LUCHA LIBRE DEL MUNDO EN VIVO 7 DE DICIEMBRE DEL 2015- 21:00 HRS (posted by VideosOficialesCMLL)
15:34, Disturbio & Policeman taking 2/3. King Jaguar & Lestat didn’t get along. Rudos destroyed one of Jaguar’s knees, leaving him stretchered out. Espiritu Maligno ran out to make the save, and seemed to be friendly with Lestat.
3) Fuego, Rey Cometa, Stigma b Canelo Casas, Okumura, Skándalo LA MEJOR LUCHA LIBRE DEL MUNDO EN VIVO 7 DE DICIEMBRE DEL 2015- 21:00 HRS (posted by VideosOficialesCMLL)
17:26. Tecnicos took 2/3.
4) Ángel de Oro, Dragon Lee, Stuka Jr. b Ephesto, Luciferno, Mephisto LA MEJOR LUCHA LIBRE DEL MUNDO EN VIVO 7 DE DICIEMBRE DEL 2015- 21:00 HRS (posted by VideosOficialesCMLL)
12:59. Rudos took 2/3.
5) Marco Corleone b Shocker LA MEJOR LUCHA LIBRE DEL MUNDO EN VIVO 7 DE DICIEMBRE DEL 2015- 21:00 HRS (posted by VideosOficialesCMLL)
Marco took 2/3, beating Shocker clean to remain undefeated in singles matches in 2015.
6) Kráneo, Ripper, Último Guerrero b Atlantis, Valiente, Volador Jr. LA MEJOR LUCHA LIBRE DEL MUNDO EN VIVO 7 DE DICIEMBRE DEL 2015- 21:00 HRS (posted by VideosOficialesCMLL)
10:05. Rudos took 1/3.

There was nothing horrible, but there was nothing worth going out of your way to watch on the show. No lineup for next week yet. No lineup for Sunday’s show either. No lineup for any IWRG lineup. Maybe lucha libre is just ending this week and no one’s told me? Probably not.

The news from the show were the announcements in between matches. The Christmas and New Year’s Day shows, which they’ve been talking about for weeks as having special (5pm) starting times, also now have names.

12/25: Infierno en el Ring
01/01: Sin Piedad

This fits with the theory from earlier this week: the early December big show concept is generally gone for now, and they’re moving the big shows to later in the month. They may not be loaded shows because CMLL just won’t do loaded shows, but at least something might happen. Infierno en el Ring is nearly always a cage match, and highlights of past cage matches were shown elsewhere on the show. Sin Piedad is a more general purpose name. The last one appears to be in 2012, when La Sombra defeated Tama Tonga in the finals of a Copa Junior. I don’t think they’ll be rematching. The 01/01 show has recently been the site of a lot of opening match luchadors losing their hair or mask.

2012: Hombre Bala & Super Halcon Jr. beating Rayo Tapatio I & II for the masks (Rayo Tapatios’ final CMLL match)
2013: Bobby Zavala & Disturbio beating Leono & Tigre Blanco for hairs (Tigre Blanco’s final CMLL match)
2014: Copa Junior (focusing on first/second match luchadors)

The Soberano Jr./Star Jr. mask win over Ramstein/Cholo last year took place on 01/06 last year. If they go back to the normal pattern, Super Comando versus The Panther should take place on 01/01. I really hope it’s not the end of Super Comando entirely; if Cholo can stick around, he can too. There’s enough other luchadors who’ve done match feuding challenges that they may not be needed in a 12/25 cage match anyway.

We’ll probably have a good idea of whatever they’re planning by tomorrow afternoon. CMLL’s announcers also said there would be the usual Wednesday noon press conference for announcements. The press conference will stream on CMLL’s website, probably thru YouTube again.

One item which was not announced, but hinted at, is the continued tease of a new group of trainees debuting. Iv’e mentioned it seems like one is coming, and the video package seemed to confirmed it. A video package hyped the stars of recent trainee classes and very briefly showed footage of new trainees working out around the Arena Mexico ring. (Paco Alonso was visible, if you looked very closely.) Magia Blanca was at the front of the line when they were running around, so it was recent footage but we didn’t get much a look at who else might be in line. There were also way more people in the shot than are likely going to debut. It’s possible CMLL may introduce the next class entirely at the Wednesday press conference. They’ll be trickling in on cards over the next couple months either way.

Arena Mexico has Atlantis, Titan, and Volador facing Dragon Rojo, Hechicero and Polvora in the main event. Guerrero Maya Jr. and Bobby Z continue their rivalry in the lightning match. The tercera has Fuego, Pegasso, Triton versus Sangre Azteca, Puma and Tiger, all of whom could end up in the cage match.

Guadalajara has the Hijos del Infierno defending the trios championship against Angel de Oro, Blue Panther and Stuka Jr. A title change would be a big surprise. Rush is listed in the main event; Rush is also listed as wrestling Puebla at 4. That’s the other way. I dunno, he’ll probably work Guadalajara.

Averno is still listed as wrestling in Arena Quetereo today. Your guess is as good as mine.

The LLF Anniversary show saw Heronia lose her mask to Krystal, Estrella Explosiva take La Chacala’s hair, and Karisma win the main LLF title from Angelica.

12/25 LuchaMemes updated card:
Lucha Memes added another match to their 12/25 card. Show so far
Negro Navarro vs Virus
Black Terry & El Dandy vs Trauma I & Trauma II
Keira vs Marclea (c) for CMLL Women’s Championship
Negro Casas vs Dr. Cerbero
Arez, Belial, Impulso vs Toscano, Decnnis, Zumbido – new

On Kushida’s regular NJPW podcast (translated via @reasonjp), he mentioned NJPW had expected Sombra over for FantasticaMania, and said the relationship between CMLL & NJPW is as mysterious to him as it is to us. There’s something not quite right there, because the Sombra was still around when the FantasticaMania lineup was announced, but NJPW only found out something was up when they asked for him.

DTU is running Arena Xalapa on Christmas.

LuchaWorld has KrisZ’s news update and this week’s Poster-Mania.


CMLL (SAT) 12/12/2015 Arena Coliseo
1) Acero vs Pequeño Violencia
2) Leono vs Inquisidor
3) Starman vs Arkángel de la Muerte
4) Star Jr. vs Nitro
5) Marcela vs Amapola
6) Guerrero Maya Jr. & The Panther vs Misterioso Jr. & Sagrado
7) Blue Panther, La Máscara, Super Porky vs Boby Z, Euforia, Gran Guerrero

Maybe Maya & Panther can get a title shot after three straight wins. Marcela and Ampola was a big match at one point (and they’ll be on Informa to talk about this one.)

CMLL (SUN) 12/13/2015 Arena Coliseo Guadalajara
1) Capitan Cobra vs Quca
2) Ángel Aéreo & Rey Halcón vs Mercenario & Mr. Brisa
3) León Blanco, Metatrón, Nautilius vs El Chakal, Évola, Sádico
4) El Alteño, El Yaqui, Vaquero Jr. vs Carlos Rogi, Exterminador, Mr. Apolo
5) Mr. Niebla, Mr. Trueno, Negro Casas vs Delta, Gallo, Stuka Jr.

At least we know four people who aren’t working Sunday’s Elite show.