box.
This isn’t lucha, but if I have this right
- TV Azteca now airs SmackDown at 11:30 pm on Friday night.
- Televisa’s airing of WWE RAW is now Sunday afternoon (directly after AAA!), a six day delay
Seems like they’ve lost the interest of the network, and this would seem to make it tougher to draw in Mexico next time they come in (still not announced.)
=== CMLL ===
Galavision/Televisa: Mistico! This is an easy call. Probably as the main event, regardless of how it was taped.
FOX: which leavs the tag team title match for this show.
C3: Diamante Azul/Titan/Valiente vs Avernos + Cancerberos vs Tuareg
52MX: Tiffany vs Marcela and other matches you might seen. They may need to edit the hair match to fit in the time, which could help.
GDL: maybe back?
Terra: Averno vs Sombra
=== Other ===
AAA: Infernal Rockers, minis, Chessman, Octagon & Ultimo Gladiador vs Elegido, Extreme Tiger, La Parka
ACM: More Chicanas?
#1 by Rob on August 9, 2012 - 11:44 pm
I know we disagree on this but I wouldn’t air the Dragon Lee match. I’d show highlights 3 times per show ala the promo videos they were doing and that’s it.
#2 by Nikita on August 10, 2012 - 4:38 pm
I agree on that Rob. If their business model is built on attendance, then why give away anything big on tv?
#3 by Alfredo on August 10, 2012 - 4:45 pm
@Nikita: they’ve been giving away everything on TV and now online for a few years now. I don’t think their business model has been built on attendance for the past 4-5 years now.
#4 by Daniel on August 11, 2012 - 3:47 am
@Rob: That exactly the kind of thing that will piss the fans off, and make them stop watching the tv show. Once they stop watching the show on tv they’ll stop going to the Arena
@Nikita: With that kind of logic why show anything on TV at all? Why not just have commercials advertizing the event?
You guys need to remember that fans who like the product will pay money to be there live regardless of whether or not it airs on free TV. The same can be said about every sport, not just wrestling. Seeing it on TV will captivate them and make them want to be there.
Think about it, people will pay up to $120 for ringside seats at RAW when they can be watching it for free at home. People will pay $500 for wrestlemania tickets when they could just pay $70 to watch it at home on PPV. Think about it, TV does not hurt ticket sales, it HELPS ticket sales.
#5 by Random Guy on August 11, 2012 - 9:20 am
Smartest thing Daniel said in awhile.
Infernal Rockers is my main priority.
#6 by Rob on August 11, 2012 - 1:49 pm
@Daniel: I’m not really sure comparing the WWE business model of television to the AAA/CMLL business model is the smartest thing considering WWE gets millions upon millions for their show while AAA/CMLL get a big fat ZERO and are an afterthought to the channel. Also you are comparing a LIVE show to a TAPED show.
I think you should stick to being creepy. It suits you better.
#7 by Nikita on August 11, 2012 - 3:49 pm
Well, even if CMLL’s business model isn’t solely dependent on just ticket sales, CMLL is not in the same ballpark with WWE as far as their main stream of revenue coming from television.
In general, the WWE is straight up paid to deliver a television show to USA/SyFy, and their revenue from those shows are determined by the ratings numbers. So in that case, it behooves the WWE to give away “PPV quality” matches on television, because the company gets paid for the ratings that those matches airing provides.
I am not privy to anything as far as contracts go, but that doesn’t seem to be the type of television deal CMLL has. CMLL seems to have a deal where the various networks just pay them a fee to provide content. I definitely think CMLL could use that airtime better to promote their live events, but instead they choose to approach it kinda how NBC is with the Olympics – you get to see the event that you missed live.
Before the “Monday Night Wars”, territorial wrestling programming *was* a commercial for other live events – that’s why they were in studios and were mostly squash matches. The promos were there to hook you to buy a ticket to the upcoming house show.
And really, we are kinda picking nits if you look at things from the big picture. Televisa is a nationwide network that is seen by a fair amount of people that aren’t in Mexico City, right? So a lot of people in places like Monterrey are only gonna see Mistico (or any other CMLL folks) on Televisa.
#8 by Daniel on August 11, 2012 - 5:23 pm
@Rob: As always you’re missing the point. Regardless of the promo or the sport fans will pay money to see the live action if they like the product. Seeing it on TV does not give you the same feeling of seeing it in person. If people are not entertained by CMLL on tv they’ll stop watching and thus they won’t buy tickets for it. Also like Nikita said, fans who live far from Mexico city are not going to be making weekly trips to Arena Mexico, but when CMLL goes to their town then they’ll be compelled to buy a ticket if they like what they see on TV.
You say I should stick to being creepy because it suits me better? I say that you should STOP being a fucking nerd, and stop acting like a know it all because it does not suit you at all.
And for anybody reading this I want to point out that Rob offended me first, before I get a bunch of notes saying that I’m “not respecting people’s opinions”
#9 by Rob on August 11, 2012 - 6:52 pm
@Daniel: Well we’ll see how smart you are in the next few weeks. Dragon Lee’s initial appearences outside of Arena Mexico have bombed. Now that he’s on TV everyone is going to come see him according to your genius deduction. I can’t wait till you humble me with photographs of the huge crowds!
#10 by Rob on August 11, 2012 - 6:56 pm
On the same note I assume when/if I’m proven right and Arena Mexico attendance starts to dip since he’s now on TV and he continues not to draw anywhere else you will be a man and tell everyone I was right.
(I am fully aware you won’t and are already preparing excuses.)
#11 by Daniel on August 11, 2012 - 8:29 pm
@Rob: I was talking in general about TV. Arena Mexico was the fullest it’s been all year for his debut so obviously his debut drew interest. For the fans who live too far away from Mexico city I can assure you that they were tuning into Televisa. I don’t have a ratings chart to back that up so that’s just and educated guesse. If CMLL had decided to deprive the Televison audience of that people would be like “what the fuck?” and people would say stuff like “well if they’re just gonna show crap on TV, why the fuck should I waste time watching?” Then if they stop watching it on TV why will they pay tickets to attend something they have lost interest in.
So in conclusion the bigger issue is not Mistico, it’s that when you have a TV show that is broadcast nation wide, you present your best because that’s what gives your company a good name and that’s what draws crowds.
Do you uderstand now? Whether or not Mistico maintains fan interest is a whole other issue, so regardless of how this turns out I will never tell you you’re right because you’re not. If you owned CMLL, or any other wrestling company then it would go out of business fast.
#12 by Rob on August 11, 2012 - 9:47 pm
@Daniel: “Whether or not Mistico maintains fan interest is a whole other issue, so regardless of how this turns out I will never tell you you’re right because you’re not.”
Spoken like a real man willing to stand by his opinions……………….. until he’s proven wrong in which case he’ll never admit he was a fool.
Is that you Vince Russo?
#13 by Daniel on August 11, 2012 - 11:16 pm
@Rob: Actually I hate Vince Russo but even Russo would not be so stupid as to not put his top matches on TV.
By the way Rob according to your logic Mistico’s matches outside of Arena Mexico should have sold out since the people had not yet seen him on TV.
#14 by Albert on August 12, 2012 - 8:46 am
We Have Our Main Event For Anniversario: Daniel Vs Rob!
#15 by Daniel on August 12, 2012 - 1:11 pm
@Albert: I would love that
#16 by Alan on August 12, 2012 - 3:30 pm
Rob would clearly win via interference from fake Daniel.
#17 by LLL on August 13, 2012 - 2:45 pm
@Nikita: I think CMLL and AAA get $0 for their content. Goes back to when 52mx was working with Televisa. The deal was that 52mx would produce a wrestling show for Televisa and in exchange they got to use unused footage for their own network.
Pena called his second show on 52mx LLL. But Pena being Pena was unable to work with 52mx for the long term and bought his own production truck(Vicky, named after his mother), and did his own thing without 52mx.
CMLL continues to work with 52mx to this day. The benefit is that their show looks pretty good from a production standpoint, while AAA still does not even show replays and looks like a cult niche product like ECW of 1995. But there is an energy that comes from AAA television while I find CMLL un-watchable.
CMLL, because of their production, is able to secure television exposure beyond Televisa. AAA would not be able to secure anything on their own because the quality is unacceptable. They may be able to use content from the big shows, to con someone into thinking their television looks like that every week, but what we know as their weekly show would be laughed at.
#18 by LLL on August 13, 2012 - 3:01 pm
I think part of the reason Mistico II drew at Arena Mexico is because fans were curious to see CMLL debut a fake. Sure, they have had some guys like Psicosis II, but I don’t remember CMLL doing this with a top name. There was considerable hype and promos and I guess the storyline of the mask itself having mystical powers makes sense even though it’s a slap in the face of Lucha tradition.
#19 by Daniel on August 13, 2012 - 3:54 pm
@LLL: I think that’s the reason why CMLL has let the fans know that this is a new Mistico because they know that in this day and age with all the information out there, that the fans would feel that their intellingence is being insulted if they tried to pass him off as the original. The idea of Mistico being a Mystical thing that is bestowed upon an anointed luchador is a good way of going about it.
#20 by thecubsfan on August 13, 2012 - 4:01 pm
I think you guys have some points, but I don’t think you can dismiss how they advertised these shows
08/04 @ Arena Mexico: specific vignettes shown twice on every single show, mentioned during matches in passing
all the other Mistico debut matches: mentioned in passing during some but not all shows – usually with a graphic that’s on the screen but not even the announcers acknowledging it – and no other mentions.
It was neat to see Arena Puebla highlights a couple weeks ago on 52MX, but the better business move would’ve been a 30 second event center deal going over the Mistico shows the next week. I adored the La Mascara/Averno vignettes leading up to their match so it was nice to see them again on Galavision, but same deal there.
#21 by LLL on August 13, 2012 - 4:14 pm
Cubs is right. Those vignettes hyping La Mascara vs. Averno were great.
The hype for Mistico II is unprecedented. When they run on-screen graphics hyping where he’ll be(Arena Pachuca, Arena Quertaro), the graphic is accompanied by music from his intro music.